Today I've mostly bin...

[eirian]

I will admit to liking nearly all sport. In fact about the only one I can think of that I don't like is boxing, and that's on principal more than for any other reason - I don't like the fact that in order to win they have to hurt each other. (and I even catch myself watching that on occasion).
Now, I don't particularly like watching replays - because I already know the result. One of the things I love is seeing how the momentum moves from one side to the other, and seeing the score unfold, so if I already know what's going to happen, it takes some of the enjoyment away (even when the result is like last Saturday's match - I'm a liverpool fan and Sigur supports Utd ).

[Scurra]

Well, I suppose if you don't like boxing, you could always combine it with something else...

How about... Chess?!

[giraffe]

Does the chess help the boxing, because the boxing is unliely to help the chess. Personally I think they should dress up in foam giant chess piece costumes before starting the boxing, to protect themselves a bit.

[MBH]

Under the "You learn something new every day" rule - this is todays sorted out

I saw your comments on 'skill' the other page - but I've got lots of other personal issues under the headings of "can't see the point", and "they get paid HOW much?" If we were all entertained by the same things then it would be a boring world, but I don't see any entertainment from the things we're talking about.

I've got a running duel going on with the Sports Presenters at BBC Radio Newcastle - I keep telling them that just cause they can get a few thousand noisy characters into the same place, it doesn't give any weight to their minority interests One of them told me that I had no soul having no interest in sport (then verbally dropped himself in the mould of 'mindless jock' for the rest of the day).

[Scurra]

That's why I wasn't completely disagreeing with you on the subject of can't see the point - eirian seems to have got my share of the "appreciate sports" genes! (I might disagree with you on the they get paid HOW much argument, but that's a political argument rather than anything about sport per se.)

I do remember asking a sports journalist why they didn't really cover "mind sports" once though, and he was honest enough to admit that that was mostly because there wasn't any noise. And partly because the skill involved was even less evident to the average spectator even though it might actually be more impressive...

The Chess/Boxing thing is really about the absurdity of suggesting that either there is no strategic skill in boxing or that there is no physical fitness element in chess.

[giraffe]

That's why I wasn't completely disagreeing with you on the subject of can't see the point - eirian seems to have got my share of the "appreciate sports" genes! (I might disagree with you on the they get paid HOW much argument, but that's a political argument rather than anything about sport per se.)

I do remember asking a sports journalist why they didn't really cover "mind sports" once though, and he was honest enough to admit that that was mostly because there wasn't any noise. And partly because the skill involved was even less evident to the average spectator even though it might actually be more impressive...

Surely mind sports covers quizzes and that sort of thing.

[kathlyn]

That's why I wasn't completely disagreeing with you on the subject of can't see the point - eirian seems to have got my share of the "appreciate sports" genes! (I might disagree with you on the they get paid HOW much argument, but that's a political argument rather than anything about sport per se.)

How much professional footballers get paid is, I think, scanderlous. If they were paid less then gate prices would be less. Also for consideration should be that at the age of approx 35 when they are too old to play the government give them a pension!!!!!!!!! With all the money they make whilst playing surely they should be investing for their 'old age'. After all 35 is no age at all and they could and should have a second career.

[Scurra]

Actually, I'm not convinced that quizzes count as "mind sports" myself. Unless they contain some element other than rote regurgitation of memorised facts. In general, in a quiz you either know the answer or you don't. (I'm excluding ones where you can do independent research), and although having a wide range of knowledge could be regarded as a "skill", it's not clear how it is being applied.

There was a terrific new series hidden away on BBC4 late last year called Only Connect. The idea was that the questions were about "sets" of things in which you had to figure out the link between items that often on the surface appeared unrelated, or, alternatively, presented in a confusing form. Thus even having that wide range of knowledge didn't automatically mean you could answer the questions.

[Scurra]

How much professional footballers get paid is, I think, scandalous. If they were paid less then gate prices would be less.

This is why I said it was a political argument. Are you making this assertion based on actual statistics, or on media coverage of the top Premiership stars? Do you know how many "professional" footballers there are in this country, and what their average wage actually is?

I want to stress here that I am absolutely not supporting the abnormally high salaries and bonuses that are paid to even the moderately-talented players, but merely saying that it isn't particularly out of step with the top performers in any business - the only difference is that we tend to only hear about comparable levels of pay in the business world when something goes horribly wrong...

[I am interested in your comment about pensions though. I don't think that the "government" is paying the pension, I believe they are paying into a pension scheme like anyone else, and, if they do choose to take it early, it suffers from the same penalties as any other early retirement claim but much worse since they are taking it so early.]

[kathlyn]

I read an article ages ago and it certainly implied that they get their pension as soon as they have to stop playing because after about 35 years of age their bodies can't cope with the rigours of professional play.

[giraffe]

The state retirement age for most professions is 65, but for firefighters is 55 (ish) and ballerinas is 35 (ish) I'm working from memory here, but it is different for different professions, and presumably they are then entitled to a state pension. No one would argue with firefighters getting theirs early, but you would think a ballet dancer could retrain.

[kathlyn]

The state retirement age for most professions is 65, but for firefighters is 55 (ish) and ballerinas is 35 (ish) I'm working from memory here, but it is different for different professions, and presumably they are then entitled to a state pension. No one would argue with firefighters getting theirs early, but you would think a ballet dancer could retrain.

along with the overpaid footballers

[katsmom]

Here in HK, retirement for female teachers is 55 (if I was told correctly) males can teach until 60. UNLESS you have the funny hat, then you can stick around as long as you want if you still have HALF your wits about you. You don't even need a full brain if you have that funny hat.

Why do you think I'm studying for one? So I can officially become a half wit and not be worried about it anymore

[clvrlad]

lol
what do you mean become a half wit

im one allready

[Scurra]

You can call yourself a half wit, clvrlad. And we can all call you a half wit.

But that's very different from being an "official" half wit. That takes a lot more dedication than you (or I!) will ever be prepared to put in.

[katsmom]

I already know I'm a half wit. I just want the hat for it to be official and I can then come out of hiding.

At my Uni, they even have a place they put the half wit's. It's called upstairs. Until we are official, they hide us in the basement

[Laura]

Today I've mostly bin...

trying to write a letter of application for a new job, but at the school I'm already at, without saying that I don't like my current job, but while still saying that I do want the different job.

MBH - I agree with you entirely today - My Brain Hurts!!!!!

[MBH]

There was a terrific new series hidden away on BBC4 late last year called Only Connect.

I saw a couple of them - very clever idea. (I think I may have been pointed towards it by DVP - possibly even you). Those that didn't see it - keep an eye out for future series

Whenever I hear the term "Professional Footballers" I tend to mentally replace it with "Overgrown, overpaid kids kicking a ball about" No! - I'm not popular, living in Newcastle and working in Sunderland

I don't read newspapers, but the usual time I hear about footballers they are drunk as skunks, wrapping their cars around trees, being paid fortunes for sitting 'injured' for moths (or stuck in jail), or simply not being able to do their job (I.e. scoring goals)

My personal opinion is that nobody is worth what you hear about people being paid. The same for 'top business people' (someone mentioned 'pensions'). I'm actually interested in sitting down and having a logical chat with the people who write and agree these 'contracts' that do not seem to have "What if..." clauses. Nice work if you can get it

I fully expect to be working until I'm 90 out of financial necessity

[Scurra]

OK, I'm going to stick my moderator's hat on now, even though I'm guilty of this as much as anyone else.

But I don't really think that Puzzlebrains needs to become a forum for arguments like this, no matter how well-intentioned we all start out. Once you get into politics, experience on other forums has taught me that an argument is pretty much doomed. Arguing about whether there is any skill required to play sports professionally is one thing. Throwing around phrases like "Overgrown, overpaid kids kicking a ball about" isn't really contributing to that... Thanks.

Today, I have mostly bin... rewriting a puzzle for issue four, and now MBH too. I hate to think what it will do to the rest of you

[fernando]

I'm a liverpool fan and Sigur supports Utd ).

I too am a liverpool fan. You'll never guess who my favorite player is